Talking about sex is hard, no matter how old you are | The Excerpt

On Friday’s episode of The Excerpt podcast: Our beliefs about sex and marriage have shifted tremendously over the years – both a reflection and a driver of how we talk about sex. Baby boomers went in search of sex at Woodstock with minimal sexual education. Gen X groped at grunge festivals and in the back seats of cars as the AIDS crisis revealed sex's potential deadly consequences. Millennials found abstinence-only lesson plans in school at odds with the bountiful, never-ending pornography lurking on the internet. How does our age influence our sex lives? USA TODAY Wellness Reporter David Oliver joins The Excerpt is the second of four specials exploring how different generations are handling life’s pressure points.

Hit play on the player below to hear the podcast and follow along with the transcript beneath it. This transcript was automatically generated, and then edited for clarity in its current form. There may be some differences between the audio and the text.

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Dana Taylor:

Hello and welcome to The Excerpt. I'm Dana Taylor. Today is Thursday, October 10th, 2024, and this is a special episode of The Excerpt. Why is it so challenging to talk about sex? After all, none of us would exist without it. And why am I the person challenged with leading this conversation suppressing the urge to giggle? USA TODAY reporters looked at a variety of issues and topics ranging from retirement planning to climate change through the lens of generations old, aging, and young. On the issue of sex, we found that most still struggle to talk about what we see, what we experience, and what we want. Here to discuss a generational divide when it comes to talking about and having sex is USA TODAY wellness reporter David Oliver. Thanks for joining me, David.

David Oliver:

Yes, of course. Thanks for having me.

Dana Taylor:

Despite decades passing, since the free love movement of the 1960s, it's still difficult to talk about sex. Why is that, and does that hold true for boomers as well as Gen Z?

David Oliver:

It holds true for everyone, really. I think particularly for boomers, this was a generation that really did not grow up with a lot of knowledge about sex in terms of their parents talking to them about it. Many boomers I spoke with learned about sex in a trial and error kind of way. They start having it in high school or later in life and sort of figuring it out without many examples. While you see Gen Z and millennials, on the other hand, having more exposure through media, having more conversations about it, through books, things like that. It's just a more open conversation. That doesn't necessarily mean, though, that it's any easier to talk about.

Dana Taylor:

You looked at the way millennial and Gen X parents are teaching their children about sex. What's the difference in the way boomers learned about sex compared to Gen Z? What's the sex talk like now?

David Oliver:

Sex talk has grown extremely differently, actually. Right now it's focused a lot more on consent, is probably the biggest shift. In that previously you learned about the birds and the bees and were explaining very much the basics on sex, but now it's something that parents are making clear it's not something that anyone is entitled to have. There's less emphasis on virginity in the traditional sense. It's more about making sure that all parties are comfortable with their sexual experiences. That's something that we haven't seen before in terms of sex education.

Dana Taylor:

The internet has made images and videos of people engaging in sex widely available. Were you surprised to learn that Gen Z is having less sex than millennials when they were younger, despite both generations coming of age with easy access to sexual content online?

David Oliver:

So it's interesting. I think that there is some research that's suggesting that they're having less sex, but anecdotally, I don't think that's necessarily the case from the people that I spoke with. It may not be that they're having less sex, per se, but maybe less sex in the traditional sense with penetrative sex versus other types of sexual experiences. So I think there's a lot of nuance lacking in data that we're seeing coming out, and I think it's less about us wondering whether people are having less sex and more about thinking what kind of sex they're having, is it consensual, and what conversations are like about sex? I think we can focus a bit less on their sex lives and more about talking about it and making sure that they understand everything they need to have the healthiest, most pleasurable sex.

Dana Taylor:

Are we seeing a significant cultural shift among younger generations when it comes to acceptance of diverse sexual orientations? And when did that happen for boomers? How was that awareness awakening any different?

David Oliver:

So we're seeing that, I think, bear out in the data and Gallup polls in terms of people accepting of different orientations. I think that you will always see a lack of support or I guess a lower amount of support in older generations THAN younger generations. You see that in Gen Z, millennials are more accepting than Gen X and boomers just based off of norms of each time. So I think that it's been something that there's always going to be, there are queer people in each generation. We are not sure, obviously, if the amount has grown because people are more aware of their orientations and more accepting of themselves or whether there are indeed more people who are identifying that way now for other kinds of reasons. So I think that it's something that younger generations are more accepting of and older generations, on a broader scale, maybe through these surveys are not revealing that they have learned or caught up as quickly, but I don't think it's that they don't exist.

Dana Taylor:

David, you wrote that millennials are now facing boredom in the bedroom. How are they tackling that, if at all, and what did the people you spoke with share with you on that front?

David Oliver:

Well, it seems to be this is the era of people trying different relationship structures. It's not new in the sense that polyamory, swingers, all these types of groups have existed for decades, or even before that if we're talking about pre-monogamy becoming the norm in society. But right now I would say that millennials and Gen Z are challenging traditional relationship structures that maybe their parents modeled in terms of having a monogamous marriage. People are now more interested in open relationships, polyamorous relationships, and trying out things that work for them, and also the differences between what monogamy means. Can you be in a monogamous relationship but maybe still flirt? Maybe when your partner is traveling, maybe you open up your relationship for a brief period of time. It means really different things for different people, and I believe that the younger generations are more open at this point to challenging those norms and having those conversations.

Dana Taylor:

And how did boomers deal with boredom? Was that the key party era?

David Oliver:

Yes, that's certainly one way they dealt with it. The key party era was an era where boomers would become swingers, basically. They would go to somebody's house in the neighborhood, they would all drop their keys in a fishbowl type thing, somebody would pick a key, and then whoever's key that was, they would go have sex with that spouse. And it was kind of spouse swapping. That type of thing. And that's something that certainly still exists today in different forms, swinger parties, things like that haven't gone anywhere, maybe not in the exact same format that way. That's certainly how boomers and other many generations have tried to tweak up their marriages. I think that it varies. It varies per generation and everybody has different ideas of what that looks like, but that is how boomers dealt with that.

Dana Taylor:

One of the biggest takeaways from your reporting for me was the generational shift in discussing and understanding consent as you've described. Still, there's been an increase in what one of the experts you spoke with called "scary sex". This relates to violent or aggressive behaviors such as non-consensual choking. What can you share with us about that alarming trend?

David Oliver:

That's something that I think we're seeing because as porn proliferates on the internet, it's not something that's obviously new, pornography has existed many different ways over decades, over a long time, but I believe that with more access to the internet, with more ability for anybody to post videos about whatever they want, I think you're just naturally going to get people who are curious about things in unregulated internet that way in terms of what people can really share.

So with more access to internet, we get more education about sex, about a lot of different things, but we also get a darker side. So I think that's why we're seeing that happening, and it just speaks to how much more education we need about consent. That way, maybe if someone enjoys the type of pain or any type of choking during sex, that it's comfortable for them, it's safe for them in that space. I think it's important that we also don't judge certain behaviors if they work for both parties, but also making sure that no one is harmed in the process too. It's nuanced.

Dana Taylor:

For Gen X, the idea of scary sex in the 1980s and 1990s would've revolved around unprotected sex, largely due to the HIV pandemic. How do both the younger and older generations you focused on deal with sexual activity and the spread of STIs?

David Oliver:

It's something that I think younger generations are more aware of in terms of PrEP, in terms of different types of measures. There's Doxy-PEP as well that people can now take to try and prevent other STIs besides HIV. I think it's important now that we know that undetectable is untransmittable. If someone is HIV positive and they are on medications, they cannot spread this disease. So that's important to note. I think that that same danger that maybe people saw in the '80s and '90s doesn't exist today.

I think it's still important for people to know, though, the risks of STIs and how to best prevent them. Condom use, if you're monogamous with your partner, just making sure that you're otherwise being safe, getting tested regularly. I think it's a matter of education and making sure everyone's aware. You hear the stories about nursing homes, there being a lot of sex and people getting STIs because they're not using protection. It's important to use protection and be aware of what trends are and to kind of make sure you're talking to your friends about it, your healthcare providers, people who know more and are sharing stories I think is super important.

Dana Taylor:

And is there a divide there in how the generations are dealing with that?

David Oliver:

I don't believe so. I mean, I think that it's more person to person, I would say. I think that the risks for different communities are also super different, in terms of who's at most risk for HIV, who's at most risk for gonorrhea, maybe even in a given area. I think it really depends and it's not generation specific. Regardless, I would say that there should be no shame in discussing this. If you get an STI, if something happens. I think it's important that you get treated, and I think it's important that you talk about it when it happens, share the information with your partners, as well as just in general, making sure that be educated before you have sex in the first place. And that is across generations.

Dana Taylor:

David, did you find that all generations are able to enjoy sex? And is it less enjoyable for some than others?

David Oliver:

All generations are able to enjoy sex. I don't think that it changed across generations beyond the fact that everybody is entitled to learn about their body and what they want and need. It doesn't mean that everybody is going to right away when they start having sex, and it doesn't mean that your body won't change over time. Someone who is menopausal will have a different sex life than before that they may have to tweak how they approach things. The same goes for men of a certain age, if they have trouble getting an erection, things like that. So it definitely varies per generation.

Dana Taylor:

Religion has always played a role in framing what is and isn't acceptable sexual behavior in our society. Has a needle moved on that one at all? What did you hear there?

David Oliver:

I didn't hear terribly much there from people. I did hear from someone that her upbringing in religion made her feel ashamed about her body and it made her feel uncomfortable talking about it. And I think that's something to really keep in mind is that there was a lot of shame around sex, I guess, from a religious upbringing. And I believe that many religions may have that embedded in their teachings, and I think sex is often seen as a means to procreation versus a means for pleasure. And I think it's worth unpacking that and talking about that to, again, have the healthiest sex life.

I think the truth is that it is whatever works for any individual person. If they don't want to otherwise explore that for themselves, that is totally their prerogative. But from all the reporting that I did, it seems that people just need to be in tune with their own bodies and what they feel that they want and need and get educated.

Dana Taylor:

Were there any surprises for you, whether that be a similarity or a great divide when looking at the way different generations approach, have, and discuss sex?

David Oliver:

I think it was how similar that they were. I think I had my own assumptions about how I thought boomers would view sex compared to Gen Z. But I think everybody really just wants to have an enjoyable time and to feel comfortable and good with themselves and their partners. And I think that that's the biggest takeaway here is that at the end of the day, everybody wants to have good sex. We need to talk about it to make sure that that continues.

Dana Taylor:

It's not always easy to talk about, but I'm glad that you came on to have this discussion with me, David. Thanks for being here.

David Oliver:

Thanks. Yeah, of course.

Dana Taylor:

Thanks to our senior producers Shannon Rae Green and Kaely Monahan for their production assistance. Our executive producer is Laura Beatty. Let us know what you think of this episode by sending a note to podcasts@usatoday.com. Thanks for listening. I'm Dana Taylor, Taylor Wilson will be back tomorrow morning with another episode of The Excerpt.